Which M-Mount Camera after CL breaks

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BCMielke

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I didn't quite know where to put this since it was a broad question.

I shoot about 25 rolls of film a year. I see that growing some more than lessening. I had a Leica CL that I liked, but found small for my hands. The meter didn't work, which initially I didn't like, but grew to tolerate. I dropped it yesterday and the underside rolling winder popped out. When I put it back in I found that it no longer would wind(or unwind) the film. Because of this I am looking at a new camera. I could of course get the old CL fixed, but that seems like throwing good money after bad since I wasn't "in love" with the camera anyway. I might be able to sell it for parts, but it is currently unusable.

Unfortunately I had just purchased the Voigtlander 40mm to add to the problem. I can still use it on my Digital M, but all other Leica's don't have 40mm frame lines. <sigh>

I love my M 240, but I'm not married to the Leica name for my lesser used film camera because of that I need some help mainly because after many google searches there are just so many choices to choose from. Leica, Bessa's, Zeiss Ikon, Hexar and some Russian cameras thrown into the mix. Even Canon and Nikon have a RF. There are too many choices. Let's start off with the needs.

1. I really didn't want to spend more than $1,000 for this camera.
2. A meter would be nice, but I could live without a meter and have
3. I like the idea of not needing batteries
4. I shoot mostly 50mm with it, but have liked being able to mount 28mm lenses. I have a 35mm finder that I could use. I came from the DSLR world so sacrilege or not I change lenses on my Leica.
5. I would like to use the 40mm I just purchased, but since it was used I could apply that money to a more expensive Leica if that was the choice.


I have put the above in some kinda order so help me sort through all of the myriad of choices that I have to come to the right one.

Thanks so much.
 
If you shop around you'll find a good M6 within your budget. M6 35mm framelines work very well for me and 40mm, earlier Leicas not so much.

If you want real 40mm framelines and battery independent, you can pick between Rollei 35rf and the Bessa R3M. But I suspect you might not fall in love with these either ...

Good luck !

Roland.
 
40mm frame lines are not really a problem, just use 35mm frame lines and frame knowing that you are going to cut off a little. I have a Summicron 40mm and that's what I do. The difference between 35mm and 40mm is really quite minimal.

Oh, and for Leicas that do not have 28mm framelines, just use the entire finder. I.e. the M2 and M4 have only 35/50/90mm frames but the viewfinder is a .72, just like the M6, M7, etc. The only difference is the frames (and well, the rangefinder flare problems with the M6 under certain circumstances), so you can just use the entire viewfinder as a very clean and non-cluttered frame 🙂
 
Please someone correct me if I'm wrong, but do Voigtlander Bessas have accuracy problems (at least in comparison to Leica M bodies) due to the short rangefinder base? I have never shot a Bessa, but a few months ago I was loaned an Epson R-D1 (basically, a digital Bessa) and focusing it accurately was a problem that none of my Leicas ever had.
 
I had a CL which I broke. Then I tried a M3 with the framing window (middle) covered with Black Tap and used the whole viewfinder to approximate the 40mm. Found out later that it was still a bit wide. Then I tried the other way round, jam the preview lever for 35mm on the m4 but found it too troublesome. Then I finally gave up and found a $200 used beaten up R3A (A = battery required, has Aperture priority) here on RFF. Used it recently and the whole camera got soaked by rain, it was so bad that the VF fogged badly and I couldn't focus only scale focus. After a day, the camera dried nicely and VF became clear again. I like the R3A because of the 40mm lines, I found the R3A a bit big and a bit loud. I am ambivalent to the 1:1 VF, i wear glasses and it isnt spectacle friendly.

rain.jpg



raytoei
 
Redseele said:
Please someone correct me if I'm wrong, but do Voigtlander Bessas have accuracy problems (at least in comparison to Leica M bodies) due to the short rangefinder base? I have never shot a Bessa, but a few months ago I was loaned an Epson R-D1 (basically, a digital Bessa) and focusing it accurately was a problem that none of my Leicas ever had.
Click to expand...

I had no problems focussing a 40mm f/1.4 Nokton or 90mm f/2.8 Elmarit on an R3A. A 50mm f/0.95 Noctilux might not be so forgiving.
 
BCMielke said:
...

1. I really didn't want to spend more than $1,000 for this camera.
2. A meter would be nice, but I could live without a meter and have
3. I like the idea of not needing batteries
4. I shoot mostly 50mm with it, but have liked being able to mount 28mm lenses. I have a 35mm finder that I could use. I came from the DSLR world so sacrilege or not I change lenses on my Leica.
5. I would like to use the 40mm I just purchased, but since it was used I could apply that money to a more expensive Leica if that was the choice.


I have put the above in some kinda order so help me sort through all of the myriad of choices that I have to come to the right one.

Thanks so much.
Click to expand...

If your main lenses are 28,40,50 with the above criteria, I'd go with a Bessa R4M and use 35mm framelines for the 40mm.
 
Hallo,

i have a M6 an ZI but nevertheless lately i came to re-buy a Bessa R2 which i really regreted selling. It gets the most use of them all:

- Ergonomics: Its the lightest and simplest and thanks to the littel rubbergrip on the back it is easiest to hold and shoot, even with one hand, which is impossible/uncomfortable with the leica and feasable but not as comfortable with the ZI. I tend to grab it all the time instead of the others, when just going out without a certain shootingintent. Its a great carryaroundshooter - you don´t feel, you have to treat it like a treasure. No worry to use it in dangerous (for the camera) or dirty situations.

- The Viewfinder: The Bessa and Zeiss viewfinders are superior to the Leica M6, at least i can see more around the 35mm frame in those, but exept the superviewfinder of the Zeiss its just minor differences. They are all clear and contrasty, no problem, the bessa might be ab bit behind maybe in that regard. Of course the rangefinderbaselenght with the bessa is the shortest but it is still plenty enough for your nokton as long as you don´t plan on shooting a noctilux or a 90mm summicron...

- 40mm: As you prefer to use the 40mm nokton i would go for a Bessa R3a/m. The 1:1 viewfinder is great as you can use ist both eyes open. The virtual baselength is longer due to the greater magnification of the finder so focusig is even more accurate than on the other bessas. I personally wouldn´t go with a 35mm frame or 50 or a frameless solution on the M3 - especially when i am able to choose the camera accordingly.

- Carry around: In the end the bessas fit perfectly with the skopars and little noktons as the ensemble stays super compact and light. I carry it around in the same littel compact Lowepro AF2 compact camera pouch, that i use with my x100 too. I just throw that in my bag - no padded inserts of camerabags or the like. No need for a cap either, just a uv-filter and i can grab it ever ready out of my bag.

All rangefinders are great cameras and i have a use for all of them. The bessa though is the easiest/simplest to carry around. If shooting is the primary intent or there is even a planned shooting, the other rangefinders have some other benefits, too of course.

I would have a second thought on the battery question. Beeing independent for shooting is quite nice and i also have the feeling they could be more "solid" or "reliable" ... at least, when it comes to the point, when the batteries die. But in the end its not a big thing to carry around a couple of spare LR66 and the aperture priority really is very handy, for the moments you don´t want to think for each shots exposure and want to be quick without loosing the time to match aperture and time manually.

I Hope some of the thoughts are usefull to you. In the end all modern rangefindercameras from Germany and Japan are great cameras and a joy to use. There are no wrong decisions in that regard.

schöne Grüße,

Johann
 
I have a lot (too many, really) of rangefinder cameras of various types, but the one I actually USE consistently is my Bessa R3A. It is significantly larger than your CL, but somewhat smaller than an M Leica. It has a good solid feel to it, and is basically a poor man's M7- with 40mm frame lines. I have a CV 40mm Nokton which usually lives on this camera. The meter is extremely convenient, and accurate. Although the RF base is short, it has 1:1 magnification, something Leitz never managed to accomplish, facilitating two-eyed shooting. A splendid little camera.

Cheers,
Dez
 
Redseele said:
Please someone correct me if I'm wrong, but do Voigtlander Bessas have accuracy problems (at least in comparison to Leica M bodies) due to the short rangefinder base? I have never shot a Bessa, but a few months ago I was loaned an Epson R-D1 (basically, a digital Bessa) and focusing it accurately was a problem that none of my Leicas ever had.
Click to expand...



Depends on which Bessa and which lens.

RF accuracy chart here.
 
Thanks Everyone for all the thoughts and ideas. There were a few in there I hadn't considered.

splitimageview thanks for putting the accuracy chart there. I assume lower percentages are better?
 
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