RayPA
Ignore It (It'll go away)
raid amin said:
oh jeez!! yeah, that would probably do it.
.
fgianni
Trainee Amateur
The truth about Materazzi's Insult
Seems that each expert has a differest version
BBC Radio Five Live asked for help from a deaf lip reader, Jessica Rees, who read the words phonetically to an Italian translator.
She deciphered the insult as being "you're the son of a terrorist whore" - a translation also carried by many national newspapers in Britain on Tuesday.
The BBC's Ten O'Clock News also called in experts to study the television footage of the incident and determined the following:
Materazzi's first word to Zidane was "no" before he then told him to "calm down".
He then accused him of being a "liar" and wished "an ugly death to you and your family" on the day the Frenchman's mother had been taken to hospital ill. This was followed by "Go f*** yourself".
Lip readers for Brazil's Globo television as concluding Materazzi had told Zidane his sister was a "prostitute".
Rumor has it that Materazzi called Zidane's father a 'harki' - the Arabic term for Algerians who fought for France against Algeria during the occupation. It's beyond all insults, the ultimate traitor.
If this is true it means that they did their research - Le Pen suggested the same thing 9 years ago and in the next game Zidane stomped on a Saudi player who repeated it.
Paris-based anti-racism group SOS Racisme says Materazzi apparently called Zidane a "dirty terrorist", citing "several very well informed sources from the world of football
Materazzi, 32, told Gazetta dello Sport: "I held his shirt for a few seconds only, then he turned to me and talked to me, jeering.
"He looked at me with a huge arrogance and said, 'If you really want my shirt I'll give it to you afterwards'. I replied with an insult, that's true."
Materazzi has not elaborated on what he did say, but one report suggested he responded with: 'I'd rather take the shirt off your wife'.
And finally the most reliable source: Me I did my own lip reading and came to the conclusion that Materazzi told Zidane:
You call that a header? I bet you could not hit my chest with that bald head!
Seems that each expert has a differest version
BBC Radio Five Live asked for help from a deaf lip reader, Jessica Rees, who read the words phonetically to an Italian translator.
She deciphered the insult as being "you're the son of a terrorist whore" - a translation also carried by many national newspapers in Britain on Tuesday.
The BBC's Ten O'Clock News also called in experts to study the television footage of the incident and determined the following:
Materazzi's first word to Zidane was "no" before he then told him to "calm down".
He then accused him of being a "liar" and wished "an ugly death to you and your family" on the day the Frenchman's mother had been taken to hospital ill. This was followed by "Go f*** yourself".
Lip readers for Brazil's Globo television as concluding Materazzi had told Zidane his sister was a "prostitute".
Rumor has it that Materazzi called Zidane's father a 'harki' - the Arabic term for Algerians who fought for France against Algeria during the occupation. It's beyond all insults, the ultimate traitor.
If this is true it means that they did their research - Le Pen suggested the same thing 9 years ago and in the next game Zidane stomped on a Saudi player who repeated it.
Paris-based anti-racism group SOS Racisme says Materazzi apparently called Zidane a "dirty terrorist", citing "several very well informed sources from the world of football
Materazzi, 32, told Gazetta dello Sport: "I held his shirt for a few seconds only, then he turned to me and talked to me, jeering.
"He looked at me with a huge arrogance and said, 'If you really want my shirt I'll give it to you afterwards'. I replied with an insult, that's true."
Materazzi has not elaborated on what he did say, but one report suggested he responded with: 'I'd rather take the shirt off your wife'.
And finally the most reliable source: Me I did my own lip reading and came to the conclusion that Materazzi told Zidane:
You call that a header? I bet you could not hit my chest with that bald head!
fgianni
Trainee Amateur
drmatthes said:
FIFA did kick out Frings, using evidence freely available on the German media, I am starting to find this "blame the bloody Italians" game a bit irritating.:bang:
akalai
Well-known
fgianni said:
Surely you aren't REALLY that dense....
Didier
"Deed"
Whatever Materrazzi said (I bet it was dirty), it does not justify Zidane's reaction. It is known that Zidane has a hot temper and every defender he faced in this tournament provocated him.
Insulting and verbal slandering are very common on every football field. Football is not an orphan's game. Those who argue about that now are probably those who would have liked another champion than Italy, and are now seeking the fly in the ointment.
Remember, when France got world champion in 1998, a few hours before the final, Brazil striker Ronaldo got "suddenly ill". Coincidence? Honi soit qui mal y pense... What I can say is that I definitely prefer insults to a conscious toxication...
Didier
Insulting and verbal slandering are very common on every football field. Football is not an orphan's game. Those who argue about that now are probably those who would have liked another champion than Italy, and are now seeking the fly in the ointment.
Remember, when France got world champion in 1998, a few hours before the final, Brazil striker Ronaldo got "suddenly ill". Coincidence? Honi soit qui mal y pense... What I can say is that I definitely prefer insults to a conscious toxication...
Didier
nomade
Hobbyist
Ah, i think the kings of dity play and diving were Portugal this year
jonasv
has no mustache
fgianni said:
Why can't you see beyond this? Zidane HAS been condemned. He HAS gotten a red card and WILL get a suspension. All over the world, and especially in the French press, there have been nothing but negative reactions towards what Zidane did.
Are you just frustrated an Italian player may be guilty as well? Comdemning Materazzi for what he did in no way means Zidane is any less responsible for what he did. Because Zidane did what he did, Materazzi can just get away with it?
Zidane is just as guilty as Totti.
APART FROM THAT, let me repeat that and once again in caps, APART FROM THAT, Materazzi may very well be guilty as well, guilty of insulting a player - if racially, definitely against the FIFA rules. If there had been signs and possible evidence of Poulsen (possibly racially) insulting Totti, you would have seen the same talk afterwards. But he didn't...
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fgianni
Trainee Amateur
akalai said:
Oh sure I can think of many ways of doing it, only I can't think of any that would not make the "insulter" look silly, and end up generating more hilarity than anger.:angel:
fgianni
Trainee Amateur
jvx said:
No I am frustrated that whatever Materazzi did, if anything, is used to lessen Zidane's foul, it is the "he did it, it obviously is unacceptable, however" that frustrates me, no one in Italy found or looked for any however for Totti; but I guess it will happen next time, since the However seems to work a treat for Zidane.
And, as I already said, it is a poor school playground excuse.
If Materazzi did something against the rules he should suffer the consequences, but we have no proof that he really did anything wrong, still in the media, and here, Materazzi's bashing rivals Zidane's bashing.
Zidane did what he did, there is no proof yet that Materazzi did anything against the rules, until such proof is availabe I think it is only fair to refrain from blaming him.
It is the tactics of dragging in someone else in the mud to share the blame, and lessen your guilt, that I find unacceptable.
Marc-A.
I Shoot Film
Hello,
Now we know what Materazzi has said to Zidane. First, Materazzi claimed that he said nothing; then he admitted the insult, swearing he never insulted Z's mother ... she's sacred! Now we know not only that Materazzi s a liar, but also that he's a scum.
I read somewhere that "provocations are part of the game". No sorry, they are not! If they were, head-butts would be too. In everyday life, people fight for no reason, some punch you just because you touched one's car ... but on the pitch it should be different? Would you remain cool at work if some client insulted your wife or your sister, let alone your mother. Would I remain cool if a student of mine told something like that?
You know what, sometimes honour is more important than a world cup. Oh no, but Materazzi is surely an "honourable man", Marc-A. dixit.
Marc-Antoine
Now we know what Materazzi has said to Zidane. First, Materazzi claimed that he said nothing; then he admitted the insult, swearing he never insulted Z's mother ... she's sacred! Now we know not only that Materazzi s a liar, but also that he's a scum.
I read somewhere that "provocations are part of the game". No sorry, they are not! If they were, head-butts would be too. In everyday life, people fight for no reason, some punch you just because you touched one's car ... but on the pitch it should be different? Would you remain cool at work if some client insulted your wife or your sister, let alone your mother. Would I remain cool if a student of mine told something like that?
You know what, sometimes honour is more important than a world cup. Oh no, but Materazzi is surely an "honourable man", Marc-A. dixit.
Marc-Antoine
nomade
Hobbyist
REgardless of what Materazzi said, no one si trying to say that Materazzi is an angel, but it's wierd that Zidane could be the victim in the end...
Marc-A.
I Shoot Film
Nomade, He's not a victim ... but he's not the bad guy TV showed us. There's a reason for his 'crazy' deed, and personally I can understand such a reaction. I don't think I would ract differently if some guy said to me that my mother and my sister are whores ... to say this on the pitch does not make it better ... to react to this insult on the pitch does not make it worse.
nomade
Hobbyist
Well Marc, i get insulted sometimes, some people use words trying to absue me, and my head boils, i want to explode, because my pride can't take that, because none can talk to me like that, but these are scums in the street, what cna i do, yell at them, so one of them can lay a hand on me, and start fighting with each other, ?? Ain't no way on earth. And then there'll be no difference.
My level of education me and my brother(so that you wouldn't say that it's quite a different position, and probably i can't defend myself), have always prevented us from getting involved with such an idiocy, and lower ourselves to that level.
Materazzi is a scum, but once you respond to him, you are not that different at all...In the time when you are angry, your class makes you avoid the trouble.
My level of education me and my brother(so that you wouldn't say that it's quite a different position, and probably i can't defend myself), have always prevented us from getting involved with such an idiocy, and lower ourselves to that level.
Materazzi is a scum, but once you respond to him, you are not that different at all...In the time when you are angry, your class makes you avoid the trouble.
darkkavenger
Massimiliano Mortillaro
I am finding this whole history to be endlessly tiring me, first of all everyone picks on Zidane, then Materazzi, then some seers or lips readers invent their own truths, and now the "god" Zidane has spoken tonight on french TV canal plus. I've heard him on the radio, he sounded sincere, but in this whole thing, it's a man's words against another man's words. Words of a man who plays in the Inter and who has a "file record" of being far from an angel on the field, against a man that the french (désolé les gars, j'étais pour la France mais quand l'Italie joue c'est mon sang qui parle) revere as a living god but that is still just a man and has already several times acted violently on the field as well. If it's true that Materazzi has said these things (which I believe probable) then he deserves a prompt punishment, and Zidane does deserve a punishment as well, even if he was provoked. And when Zidane's mother says that she wants "Materazzi's balls on a silver plate" I can't help but ask myself what the hell with her, if she can't be at least civilized and have enough pride as to shut up and savour the way her son has proved her his esteem and own pride, then she can return to live happily among her mountains. It's not because her son is a national icon that she must give herself the right to say such things.
There are days when it's really tearing me apart to be french AND italian. It has been a perfect diversion for french medias to attract attention away from France defeat, to make the french people hate the italians, and I can tell you that every day at work I'm hearing that italians are traitors and thieves, and it really hurts the sicilian in me. To hear this, me also a french, one who works for the french government, who has responsibilities and who works for the image of France abroad. There were 11 italians on the field that day and it's not because of the stupidity of Materazzi that we should be deprived of our victory. Take one like Cannavaro or Gattuso, and tell me if they didn't deserve to win the world cup. Everyone played with talent since the beginning of the world cup, now everyone blame me if you want, at least I've removed a heavy weight from my heart.
Max
There are days when it's really tearing me apart to be french AND italian. It has been a perfect diversion for french medias to attract attention away from France defeat, to make the french people hate the italians, and I can tell you that every day at work I'm hearing that italians are traitors and thieves, and it really hurts the sicilian in me. To hear this, me also a french, one who works for the french government, who has responsibilities and who works for the image of France abroad. There were 11 italians on the field that day and it's not because of the stupidity of Materazzi that we should be deprived of our victory. Take one like Cannavaro or Gattuso, and tell me if they didn't deserve to win the world cup. Everyone played with talent since the beginning of the world cup, now everyone blame me if you want, at least I've removed a heavy weight from my heart.
Max
Didier
"Deed"
Zidane's reaction was way over, there's no excuse, no discussion. He's a irascible personality, that's all. You can get the football player out of the ghetto, but you can't get the ghetto out of the football player. That's not the Italian's fault when one is practising streetfight during a football game.
If one can't stand a "son-of-a-b..." he should never step on a football field. I guess this kind of insult has happened at least 20x in every World Cup game, but Zidane is the only fool who took the bait. Definitely his problem. He has, as team leader and captain, leaved his team and his country in the lurch for his little personal problem.
The several juridical attempts to annulate the italian title are just ridiculous. Sign of bad losers, sorry.
Didier
If one can't stand a "son-of-a-b..." he should never step on a football field. I guess this kind of insult has happened at least 20x in every World Cup game, but Zidane is the only fool who took the bait. Definitely his problem. He has, as team leader and captain, leaved his team and his country in the lurch for his little personal problem.
The several juridical attempts to annulate the italian title are just ridiculous. Sign of bad losers, sorry.
Didier
darkkavenger
Massimiliano Mortillaro
Hop Suisse!
Marc-A.
I Shoot Film
Actually, you may just joke.
Ok, Darkk, would you react in another way, in the same situation?? You speak about your blood, sicilian blood; then I ask your blood: would you accept, without reacting, this kind of insult, which is the worst in Mare Nostra? Please tell me.
And Didier, that's easy for you to talk about the ghetto .... fortunately, you don't know it. There's no excuse for Zidane, but there's excuse for provocation, there's excuse for "well educated people" who fight, sometimes physically, in the Senate for superficial reasons! What are you talking about?
Materazzi is a stupid guy, from a poor background; Zidane has grown in the "Quartiers nord" of Marseille, which among the worst area in Europe; one provoked the other who reacted. They are just human who play football; they are not as well educated as the ones who decide to bomb a refugee camp or a city or a subway; they just play football. What's the hell with a head butt? The big deal ... we saw worse with Maradona (who is the best player ever) when he played for Barcelona and started a big fight (against Osasuna if I can remember); or when he used his "god" hand to score. We saw worse with Schumacher, 1982-1986 goalkeeper of the Mannschaft, when he deliberately broke the jaw of Batiston in Seville (1982)...etc
Z's reacted to a serious insult, he get a red card because it's forbidden, that's it. But he remains the best european player ever. That's what makes jealous a lot of people including first class players like Platini ...
I love ZZ and always will.
Ok, Darkk, would you react in another way, in the same situation?? You speak about your blood, sicilian blood; then I ask your blood: would you accept, without reacting, this kind of insult, which is the worst in Mare Nostra? Please tell me.
And Didier, that's easy for you to talk about the ghetto .... fortunately, you don't know it. There's no excuse for Zidane, but there's excuse for provocation, there's excuse for "well educated people" who fight, sometimes physically, in the Senate for superficial reasons! What are you talking about?
Materazzi is a stupid guy, from a poor background; Zidane has grown in the "Quartiers nord" of Marseille, which among the worst area in Europe; one provoked the other who reacted. They are just human who play football; they are not as well educated as the ones who decide to bomb a refugee camp or a city or a subway; they just play football. What's the hell with a head butt? The big deal ... we saw worse with Maradona (who is the best player ever) when he played for Barcelona and started a big fight (against Osasuna if I can remember); or when he used his "god" hand to score. We saw worse with Schumacher, 1982-1986 goalkeeper of the Mannschaft, when he deliberately broke the jaw of Batiston in Seville (1982)...etc
Z's reacted to a serious insult, he get a red card because it's forbidden, that's it. But he remains the best european player ever. That's what makes jealous a lot of people including first class players like Platini ...
I love ZZ and always will.
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Marc-A.
I Shoot Film
Didier said:
That's an argument!!! There has always been injustice in the world, that's not a reason to change the state of the world. Black people have always been despised, that's not a reason for them to ask for respect ...etc.
fgianni
Trainee Amateur
Zidane is not a saint, nor is Materazzi, I am sure some sort of provocation happened.
Unfortunately this sort of things seems to be extremely common, not only in Italy:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/world_cup_2006/5168622.stm
It would be nice if there was a way to record what is said on the pitch by every player, so that an automatic yellow card is issued if someone insults an opponent, or a ban it the fact is proven later.
But until technology will enable us to do so, a ban on taunting is unfortunately going to be simply unenforceable, so it is up to the players to be able to ignore taunting and insults.
Unfortunately this sort of things seems to be extremely common, not only in Italy:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/world_cup_2006/5168622.stm
It would be nice if there was a way to record what is said on the pitch by every player, so that an automatic yellow card is issued if someone insults an opponent, or a ban it the fact is proven later.
But until technology will enable us to do so, a ban on taunting is unfortunately going to be simply unenforceable, so it is up to the players to be able to ignore taunting and insults.
dadsm3
Well-known
Reality check here....
Obviously Zidane's fans are desperate to preserve his reputation, but what's done is done......after playing for 20 years he must have heard the same insult dozens of times. To lose his composure in a game of this importance is a black mark no question, but apparently just an asterisk on an otherwise brilliant career.
Blaming the Italian player is just sour grapes....get over it. In Canada hockey players skate around with a lethal weapon in their hands...they could literally kill someone who slashed or insulted them. But they don't, and that's called professionalism.
Zidane's loss of composure was a selfish act that cost his team dearly. Who knows the motivation? Maybe he figured it was his last chance to pay back all the insults he received over the years....
Whatever the reason his reputation is secure, but the black mark will be there. So what?
Just take the loss like gentlemen and stop pointing fingers....it's bad form.
Obviously Zidane's fans are desperate to preserve his reputation, but what's done is done......after playing for 20 years he must have heard the same insult dozens of times. To lose his composure in a game of this importance is a black mark no question, but apparently just an asterisk on an otherwise brilliant career.
Blaming the Italian player is just sour grapes....get over it. In Canada hockey players skate around with a lethal weapon in their hands...they could literally kill someone who slashed or insulted them. But they don't, and that's called professionalism.
Zidane's loss of composure was a selfish act that cost his team dearly. Who knows the motivation? Maybe he figured it was his last chance to pay back all the insults he received over the years....
Whatever the reason his reputation is secure, but the black mark will be there. So what?
Just take the loss like gentlemen and stop pointing fingers....it's bad form.
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