Avotius
Some guy
Wow, and to think I was one of the few who was backing up the EP1 because it did not have a viewfinder and that is just the way cameras are now....bragging rights? With an EP1? Boy are you barking up the wrong tree.
The EP2 is a let down because Olympus has released a "me too" product to catch up with someone else and in the mean time they have totally missed the concept of the camera. That finder is huge, the camera's concept is small and portable high quality images. This finder really goes off that concept, not to mention the camera was made with a retro design and this finder obviously is not.
count_zero
Established
I agree the EP-2 is a miss, I don't feel bad for not waiting for it. The EVF hot shoe mount is a hack they threw on just to satisfy the critics. I think Olympus m43 designers are in a limbo now trying to figure out its role in the market. Is m43 a replacement for dSLRs, or is it just a slightly more versatile point-n-shoot? Mirror-less cameras will replace dSLRs. Next step is to get rid of the mechanical shutter, but that's another 5 years out at least. So, I'm in no hurry to upgrade my EP-1.
Olympus is still going to lose out on sales from the point-n-shooters looking to upgrade because the GF-1 has an EVF AND built in flash. I was talking to a guy today looking to upgrade from his Lumix FZ28. His biggest concern was getting 18x zoom like he has on the FZ28. I told him if he wanted the equivalent with a GF-1, he would have to wait another few months for the 100-300mm lens and fork up another $1K for it. He was surprised to find out that I bought the EP-1. I told him it has in body IS, better quality at high ISO, better JPEG compression, and a stereo mic (important for recording concerts). He said the stereo mic is cool, but no built in flash and EVF. I don't know if he realizes that built-in flash doesn't work at 18x zoom. The concept of in body IS doesn't apply to him because he doesn't have existing lenses to adapt and so far the Olympus lens choices are weak. Now if you want telephoto, you have to spend extra money on the OIS. All the techno babble about image quality at high ISO and JPEG compression totally blew past him. If it had a cellphone, bluetooth and GPS, then it's a win. I told him that Fuji, and Kodak are likely to jump into m43, with all of the other vendors doing their own equivalent mirror-less system next year. He was like oh? I'll stick with my FZ28 for now.
The Pen does appeal more to the art school fashionista crowd. I don't think an EVF or built-in flash will make much of a difference in their decision making process. If anything, the Pen competes with the Leica X1 as a lower cost alternative to the M9. The EVF makes the Pen look like a dorky tourist camera instead of a slick retro-cool chick magnet. I think the biggest concern fashionistas have now is "will my friends make fun of me behind my back for not buying a leica?".
I personally think the Pen looks better than a Leica, but I wouldn't roll down Bagdad highway on the back of tank with the Pen for fear that it will break (not that I ever roll down anything on the back of a tank).
Olympus is still going to lose out on sales from the point-n-shooters looking to upgrade because the GF-1 has an EVF AND built in flash. I was talking to a guy today looking to upgrade from his Lumix FZ28. His biggest concern was getting 18x zoom like he has on the FZ28. I told him if he wanted the equivalent with a GF-1, he would have to wait another few months for the 100-300mm lens and fork up another $1K for it. He was surprised to find out that I bought the EP-1. I told him it has in body IS, better quality at high ISO, better JPEG compression, and a stereo mic (important for recording concerts). He said the stereo mic is cool, but no built in flash and EVF. I don't know if he realizes that built-in flash doesn't work at 18x zoom. The concept of in body IS doesn't apply to him because he doesn't have existing lenses to adapt and so far the Olympus lens choices are weak. Now if you want telephoto, you have to spend extra money on the OIS. All the techno babble about image quality at high ISO and JPEG compression totally blew past him. If it had a cellphone, bluetooth and GPS, then it's a win. I told him that Fuji, and Kodak are likely to jump into m43, with all of the other vendors doing their own equivalent mirror-less system next year. He was like oh? I'll stick with my FZ28 for now.
The Pen does appeal more to the art school fashionista crowd. I don't think an EVF or built-in flash will make much of a difference in their decision making process. If anything, the Pen competes with the Leica X1 as a lower cost alternative to the M9. The EVF makes the Pen look like a dorky tourist camera instead of a slick retro-cool chick magnet. I think the biggest concern fashionistas have now is "will my friends make fun of me behind my back for not buying a leica?".
I personally think the Pen looks better than a Leica, but I wouldn't roll down Bagdad highway on the back of tank with the Pen for fear that it will break (not that I ever roll down anything on the back of a tank).
aizan
Veteran
keep an eye on what ricoh and nikon have up their sleeves.
cross your fingers!
cross your fingers!
Avotius
Some guy
I agree here, the Pen does look better then that Leica X1 which is just more reason why I am baffled why they made such an obviously lazy design on the finder. Seems they could have taken the swivel bit out and made it much smaller which would have appealed to more people I would think.
Oh and I have been on a highway on the back for a tank, though it was Sichuan province not Baghdad, I would hesitate about taking the EP1 with me on that trip (I took Canon DSLR equipment) but in the end I probably would take it anyway because it turns out on those trips, having a heavy camera really sucks because of the limited space, I ended up carrying almost everything on my lap for days.
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gavinlg
Veteran
I have to admit, not completely happy with this announcement. Even the black/silver/chrome on the body looks a little odd. Also looks like the only prime they have on their roadmap is a "wide" which will probably be slow. I want fast primes.
gavinlg
Veteran
Mind you, that EVF is huge. The actual view is huge. Similar to an E-3 or 5d I believe. Like nearly film camera big.
kywong
Established
The EVF is, in my opinion, a nice addition, but the early reports suggest the AF would be more of the same, the LCD is still just 230k, plus it's quite pricey, so... I guess I'll be waiting yet again, but perhaps not for long! Ricoh's four thirds competitor is rumoured to be announced on the 10-12th of this month. And they know how to make a good small camera, but it's probably gonna be pricey since the GRD III is US$700...
Avotius
Some guy
Where did you see that road map? I know that Panasonic is planning a 28mm equiv. f2.8 which also doesn't seem that appealing.
kywong
Established
count_zero
Established
It's on dpreview. They have a 9-18mm f/4.0, and 14-150mm f/4.0 on the road map. Ironically, the 14-42mm is bundled with the EP-2 and EVF. At least the price is right (around $1k) for the entire kit. No fast primes in first half of 2010 so far. The cross-processing art filter looks neat, I totally forgot about cross-processing.
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0911/09110501olympusep2.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0911/09110501olympusep2.asp
Matus
Well-known
it is actually 9-18/4.0-5.6 and 14-150/4.0-5.6 Seems that small sensors and slow lenses rule the worlds 
Avotius
Some guy
it is actually 9-18/4.0-5.6 and 14-150/4.0-5.6 Seems that small sensors and slow lenses rule the worlds
Yeah I think mainstream camera companies seem to have forgotten how to design fast lenses and optical viewfinders....
It doesn't appear Olympus made any changes to the two weak points of the EP-1, the woeful LCD screen and confused AF system (we won't talk about the control menues and dials). They also seem to be unwilling, as they are with their DSLRs, to offer prime lenses. The EP and GF cameras cry for small fast primes. The upcoming Pany 14/2.8 will be a good match for my 20/1.7. As for the zoom lenses, a user will be better served with a Canon Ti1 or any other small DSLR, or the Pany G cameras than the EP or GF series if you want to use a zoom. The EP and GF are different beast and should be supported as such.
As for the external VF. My bet is that most of the people who buy it for the EP or GF will stop using it within months of their purchase.
As for the external VF. My bet is that most of the people who buy it for the EP or GF will stop using it within months of their purchase.
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
I think some of the disappointment in the direction these companies are taking is a misunderstanding of the target audience. While the micro 4/3 format has been usurped by the RF crowd to mount their old lenses, the primary target is the young, hip, Japanese consumer who is not primarily a photographer. These cameras push their buttons successfully.
No confusion at all. I still think we are witnessing poor execution of this product line. In addition to selling this to generation Z both companies have expressed a commitment to making these two products parts of a system. Generation Z will not be buying past the body and kit zoom. To continue generating profits from these cameras the companies will need to sell lenses, to us. By 2011 when Oly gets around to putting out a wide lens most customers will already have their kits complete with Panasonic offerings. Not to mention the inevitable realization of the short attention span of this Generation Z target of theirs who in 6 months will be wooed away by a smaller sexier offering of some other company, which may or may not be better than a Pen, but just a better fit for this crowd.
squirrel$$$bandit
Veteran
I will say one thing about this announcement, though--and about the Olympus roadmap (which, take note, includes their OWN 7-14mm f/4!)--m4/3 is looking to me like a winning format that may be with us for a long time. I didn't go for it when the G1 first came out, mostly because the body didn't appeal to me, but partly because I wasn't sure about the viability of the platform. This disappointing Oly is, if nothing else, a sign of a desire to compete, and eventually this desire will have to force innovation. ESPECIALLY if Nikon and Ricoh get involved.
I wonder if Samsung is regretting not joining m4/3, rather than inaugurating their own mirrorless format.
I wonder if Samsung is regretting not joining m4/3, rather than inaugurating their own mirrorless format.
Merkin
For the Weekend
I was really looking forward to this announcement, and I am thoroughly disappointed by it. When I heard that the EP2 was going to have an EVF, I (apparently unreasonably) assumed it would be built in to the camera. I love the concept of an EVF digital camera, I see them as potentially the modern equivalent of the original philosophy behind the Leica. Unfortunately, the execution is quite lacking on this camera. Basically, my (hopefully not incredibly unreasonable) go/no go checklist on purchasing a camera in the same vein as the EP2 is as follows- built in evf, slr style controls instead of point and shoot style controls, small form factor, and decent construction I would prefer APS-C, but in a camera that size, I would be willing to live with M43 if the rest of the camera had been right. The EP2 hits one and a half of those points, so I shall wait longer still. I waited 6 years before buying a digital point and shoot, and nearly a decade to buy a DSLR, so I am willing to be patient, but I really don't want to. Here is hoping Ricoh, Nikon, or Samsung hit more of the marks.
kywong
Established
I think that's in reference to the 7-14mm they already have for Four-Thirds. The top part of the roadmap is for Four-Thirds, the bottom part is for Micro Four-Thirds. The upcoming lenses listed for Micro Four-Thirds, apart from the two announced, are a fisheye, a wide, a macro and a super telephoto zoom.
squirrel$$$bandit
Veteran
Oh. Missed that. Not super exciting then...
kywong
Established
I know the feeling, I thought the same for 5 minutes, got super excited, and then...