Fuji X Pro-1, Who's Buying?

[gavinlg]

I do hope the AF issues get sorted. I could live with AF, as long as it gets out of my way.
Images look great. No complaints there. It just comes down to a handling and enjoyment of use.
A camera needs to get out of my way, and just let me work.

I'm going to start annoying people pretty soon I'm sure, but for the 100th time, there's nothing wrong with the AF. Owners of the x100 who have the x-pro1 have said it's better than the x100. I use the x100 over my 5d 99% of the time. I don't find the AF any worse - it's better in some ways (always always accurate, no back/front focus, sets pre-focus at 3m if can't AF lock), and worse in others (gives up quicker in low contrast light, though not to the point where it's unusable or even annoying.

Seriously, for the real world, the AF is actually pretty good on the x100. I'm sure the x-pro1 is even better. They really don't have any 'AF issues'.

 

[noimmunity]

I feel like Kai made a solid point at the end when he said:
The x pro 1 is brilliant, but flawed, it' the best auto focus digital... what ever you call it, at the MOMENT, but that's because fuji doesn't have much competition. Take it or leave it.

To observe that cameras exist in a highly volatile market with rapid cycles of innovation and that no camera is perfect is to repeat truisms.

Yawn.

 

[macjim]

It was said about the nex-5n in regards to the competition, that the autofocus wasn't great but that didn't dissuade me from buying it. Also the Leica D-Lux 5 could miss a shot leaving me with an out of focus shot. I hope it is fine for the photography that I do, but I also think people expect too much from cameras nowadays. I have a Leica M9 an that has a long learning curve when it comes to 'autofocus' - that's getting my finger to find the correct position for a given range - as it doesn't autofocus. So every camera has its good points and bad, limitations and advantages too and each are better or worse depending on what type of work you are doing. Yes I would expect it to be perfect at that price range but, hey, look at my Leica M9!

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[user237428934]

I'm going to start annoying people pretty soon I'm sure, but for the 100th time, there's nothing wrong with the AF. Owners of the x100 who have the x-pro1 have said it's better than the x100. I use the x100 over my 5d 99% of the time. I don't find the AF any worse - it's better in some ways (always always accurate, no back/front focus, sets pre-focus at 3m if can't AF lock), and worse in others (gives up quicker in low contrast light, though not to the point where it's unusable or even annoying.

Seriously, for the real world, the AF is actually pretty good on the x100. I'm sure the x-pro1 is even better. They really don't have any 'AF issues'.

If have the old 5D and the X100 and the Af of the 5D is much more responsive. All the time.

 

[jsrockit]

especially among people who: a) haven't actually used the camera; b) don't care to learn how to use it; and c) expect contrast detection to work like phase detection, or for an OVF/EVF to work like DSLR viewfinders.

Amen... keep preaching. 🙂

 

[gavinlg]

If have the old 5D and the X100 and the Af of the 5D is much more responsive. All the time.

My 5d is quicker, but not that much more responsive. Problem is that a lot of the time at wider apertures it isn't so accurate - out of every 10 shots at f1.4, a few will always be slightly out of focus. The x100 is ALWAYS accurate - it never miss focusses (unless you stuff up the parallax, but that's your own fault). Plus if the 5d can't get an AF lock it just racks the lenses focusing motor from close up to infinity a few times, which makes you lose sight of what's happening, is slow as hell, and super frustrating. The x100 just gives up straight away with the compromise of pre-setting focus at 3m so you can still get some sort of a shot.

So it evens out IMO.

 

[Benjamin Marks]

I. . . am . . .the autofocus. Bwahahhahaahaaa.

 

[noimmunity]

Amen... keep preaching.

just think of it more as mantra practice

don't know why anybody would want to preach, any more than I can figure out why people enjoy sarcasm

 

[jsrockit]

just think of it more as mantra practice

don't know why anybody would want to preach, any more than I can figure out why people enjoy sarcasm

It was a light hearted comment... and meant to be in agreement with you.

 

[nickw]

Zack told his blog readers about the deal with Fuji from the get go, mentioning at the very start the terms of his arrangement with Fuji:
"I’m also allowed to say anything I want to about it. I can love it, hate it, or be indifferent."

I missed that. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[nickw]

especially among people who: a) haven't actually used the camera; b) don't care to learn how to use it; and c) expect contrast detection to work like phase detection, or for an OVF/EVF to work like DSLR viewfinders.

I know lots of people say things who haven't used the camera, so I'm off the reviews I've read of people who used the Camera. Which at this point is Digital rev and a small handful of asian sites which I've read via google translate. Something may of gotten lost in translation, but the general consensus is: great images, AF can be annoying sometimes.

It probably works most of the time. But the times it doesn't would be frustrating. Thus i'm eagerly awaiting more real world reviews.

 

[noimmunity]

It was a light hearted comment... and meant to be in agreement with you.

Cheers, mate.

As an aside, although I haven't yet checked, I am getting curious to know if other recent camera releases incite the same sort of reactions--really overreactions--that the Fuji X100 and now X-Pro1 have incited?

 

[splitimageview]

I know lots of people say things who haven't used the camera, so I'm off the reviews I've read of people who used the Camera. Which at this point is Digital rev and a small handful of asian sites which I've read via google translate. Something may of gotten lost in translation, but the general consensus is: great images, AF can be annoying sometimes.

It probably works most of the time. But the times it doesn't would be frustrating. Thus i'm eagerly awaiting more real world reviews.

Having used the camera, I didn't find AF to be annoying or frustrating. I didn't find it to be as fast as my Nikon F100 SLR from 1999, but then again, I'm not expecting it to be. I know it's faster and more accurate than when I focus an M and that's what matters to me.

 

[jsrockit]

I am getting curious to know if other recent camera releases incite the same sort of reactions--really overreactions--that the Fuji X100 and now X-Pro1 have incited?

No, not really. I think it's because they are so close to what people want (rangefinder like, small, decently priced, etc), but then don't have the manual focus that many insist on (which is fair). Then there are those of us who really think Fuji is making the best digital cameras that aren't branded Leica and that aren't DSLRs. There's a lot to be excited about IMO.

 

[andredossantos]

Exactly, these camera's are basically everything I've wanted in a digital minus a great manual focusing system. However, I am willing to give up manual focusing as long as everything else is there. And IMO, it certainly is.

And I will never get the complaints about autofocusing being bad coming from RF users. Isn't a RF a "center point focus, then recompose" type of camera? That's exactly how I use my X100 and don't have a problem focusing.

 

[Lss]

And I will never get the complaints about autofocusing being bad coming from RF users. Isn't a RF a "center point focus, then recompose" type of camera? That's exactly how I use my X100 and don't have a problem focusing.

Good for you really. But the point of RF focusing is not really center point and recompose (for me anyway). It is about having an easy and reliable focusing system that is intuitive, fast, and accurate. (And rangefinder cameras combine this with another useful feature: the direct view for framing. This is one feature that makes the X Pro-1 so interesting to many of us.)

In an AF system, a computer tries to work out where you want to focus and then focus there. In an MF system, you focus there. As long as the first step in AF introduces a significant amount of errors, it is not optimal for all use cases and all users.

 

[gavinlg]

In an AF system, a computer tries to work out where you want to focus and then focus there. In an MF system, you focus there. As long as the first step in AF introduces a significant amount of errors, it is not optimal for all use cases and all users.

Yes. Except the X series cameras skip the first step. They don't try and figure out where you want to focus. They have a single point in the middle - that's where it focuses. Up to the user to decided where to point it.

 

[willie_901]

Yes. Except the X series cameras skip the first step. They don't try and figure out where you want to focus. They have a single point in the middle - that's where it focuses. Up to the user to decided where to point it.

While the Fuji X APS-C cameras can be set to an AF mode (multi focus) where the camera does do step 1. Most of the time this mode should not be used.

These cameras work best when the AF is used in focus and recompose mode (area focus). The degree of reliance on automation can differ depending on a number of photographer controlled decisions, but I can only get results when I use the camera as I use a mechanical RF camera, i. e. area focus mode.

There is a tiny bit of irony here because about a year ago some dismissed the X100 as an over- priced P&S camera. In fact, the camera (in my heads anyway) fails as a P&S because the AF is unreliable when focus is critical.

The AF in cameras with tiny sensors is no better, but the increased DOF and the slower lenses minimize the effect of AF errors. In P&S mode the X100 fails miserably at using F 2 and 6-12 feet in a scene with numerous high contrast subjects. With different set up parameters it succeeds.

 

[JasperD]

Finally!!! 😀

My favorite retailer switched the X-Pro1 from ´on order´ to ´available´ this morning... I don´t think I lost lots of time after that, and have his confirmation in my mailbox already. Nice to see some company coming for the cable, R72 filter and new SD card already in the drawer. Only body and 35mm for now, the other 2 lenses and additional batteries are not available yet, but at least it will ease being patient a bit. 😛

I feel I now can also participate by analogy to the poll. It´s not real pre-order but final purchase (no return policy here), but for all purposes, the intention will be real. :angel:

 

[Lss]

They have a single point in the middle - that's where it focuses. Up to the user to decided where to point it.

Except they still do need to figure out, e.g., whether you want to focus on the fence or the person behind it. Single focus point (in the middle) is no new idea.