jszokoli
Well-known
My feeling is that the guys at the NYC Leica store are somewhat snobby. Your never quite good enough for them, I just don't quite get it. It's like your caught in the middle, your just some schmuck that has the money to buy Leica, but like some people here on RFF the fact your buying or interested make you suspect, cause your just trying to buy talent.
But if your buying Leica as a luxury item holy-cow you should hear them talk about you behind your back, I have...
Back to the looting I hope they were smart and removed their inventory, face it you could likely load their whole inventory into a single SUV.
But on the flip side they do like Cal
Joe
KoNickon
Nick Merritt
Good lord. Sorry about Leica Soho (and all the small business owners who got looted -- it's really disgusting), but focusing on the looting is to totally miss the point. A guy died in police custody, for a nonviolent crime he apparently didn't comment, for being black.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
It was not in NYC. And it was not in custody, but during arrest. And it is not proved in the court, yet, about if he was handled like this just because of skin color.
But if you are so social warrior at RFF, here are threads about made in China lenses and were are millions of innocent, with no multiple criminal records including robbery with gun and violence, people. They are held in concentration camps for just been different.
But on the flip side they do like Cal
Joe
Haha so true Joe... but don’t we all!? Regarding the judgmental behavior, I have been there myself... but I try to remind myself that it’s not my wallet and that you don’t have to be good at something to enjoy it. I used to spend a lot of $ on musical equipment and I never got past the still horrible stage.
Beemermark
Veteran
NY Post had a letter to the editor from the NYC Police Chief in which he says the police force is severally undermanned. He asked for an additional 400 officers this year was turned down - again. The Mayor is very anti-police.
Emile de Leon
Well-known
daveisbest
Established
Yes, the looters are not helping with the mostly peaceful protests. It's not clear however if the looters were associated with the protests, or just criminals looking to exploit the situation.
Also the protests are not solely about making police treat black people better. They're about making the entirety of the US treat people based on their actions, rather than the colour of their skin.
raid
Dad Photographer
I immigrated to the USA. i hope that things will work out in the end. There has to be hope.
Rayt
Nonplayer Character
I get it. And we should do the best we can if this means to redirect our spending. I knew this old guy a father of an old girlfriend who hated hated hated the Japanese for lack of acknowledgement for war crimes so refused to buy Made in Japan. At the same time this was the 80’s and didn’t exactly want to risk his hard earned dollar on a Detroit vehicle either so he settled on a Chrysler K car with the Mitsubishi engine. And just like that he felt better about himself.
rulnacco
Well-known
Going back to the comments that the police may have had something to do with the Leica store getting looted--*particularly* if the looters were very efficient and looked like they knew what they were doing and what they were going after--I don't find that to be far-fetched at all.
We are talking about NYPD here. There is probably a significantly non-zero percentage of the force which, if not outright corrupt--I'm sure they're not all pure as the driven snow--at least aren't averse to an occasional nice little spot of payola, or they have dodgy friends. I'm sure more corruption exists where there are more *opportunities* for corruption, and policing in NYC would offer plenty of chances and temptations, and a good knowledge of the most profitable and softest targets.
It's really pretty easy: Cop A tells Friend B a bit about their operational plan, and which areas are likely not to get a rapid response from the cops during the chaos. Cop A also says something along the lines of "Man, if I was a looter, I'd hit that fancy camera store--you know how much those things are worth?" And if Friend B is at all, let's say, familiar with the criminal milieu (I'm being a bit polite here), he'll know that, and just how to dispose of such merchandise. Along with that from certain other stores which Cop A may have helpfully mentioned, along with perhaps which ones appear to be the softest targets.
Friend B takes care of business, and afterward slips Cop A a small gratuity for his expertise.
And of course, not that the Leica store would do this, but I'd think it would be pretty profitable to have "looters" hit your own store, "steal" all the luxury merchandise--and if you were wanting a bit of a makeover for your shop, doing a bit of well-placed property damage. Then, you claim insurance on everything (including as much of the remodelling as you can) and then sell the swag on the black market, no taxes, etc. Wins all around!
We are talking about NYPD here. There is probably a significantly non-zero percentage of the force which, if not outright corrupt--I'm sure they're not all pure as the driven snow--at least aren't averse to an occasional nice little spot of payola, or they have dodgy friends. I'm sure more corruption exists where there are more *opportunities* for corruption, and policing in NYC would offer plenty of chances and temptations, and a good knowledge of the most profitable and softest targets.
It's really pretty easy: Cop A tells Friend B a bit about their operational plan, and which areas are likely not to get a rapid response from the cops during the chaos. Cop A also says something along the lines of "Man, if I was a looter, I'd hit that fancy camera store--you know how much those things are worth?" And if Friend B is at all, let's say, familiar with the criminal milieu (I'm being a bit polite here), he'll know that, and just how to dispose of such merchandise. Along with that from certain other stores which Cop A may have helpfully mentioned, along with perhaps which ones appear to be the softest targets.
Friend B takes care of business, and afterward slips Cop A a small gratuity for his expertise.
And of course, not that the Leica store would do this, but I'd think it would be pretty profitable to have "looters" hit your own store, "steal" all the luxury merchandise--and if you were wanting a bit of a makeover for your shop, doing a bit of well-placed property damage. Then, you claim insurance on everything (including as much of the remodelling as you can) and then sell the swag on the black market, no taxes, etc. Wins all around!
Emile de Leon
Well-known
I spoke to my wife about maybe leaving the country soon ..and I was born here..I would like to leave..esp the past few years..
But the reality is.. I'm too old to move and start over somewhere else..
She said..it doesnt matter.. because its the same everywhere..I suppose she is right..she always is..
Then I said..maybe we can buy some "escape" land..10 to 20 acres..somewhere in the boonies..just in case..
She said..how are we old farts gonna live like that..
I said..get an RV..or mobile home..
She said..perhaps..
I asked her..what are we gonna do if our small town..implodes..
She said..we will probably die..everyone dies..no big thing..it happens..
But in the meantime..its a good thing..to try to remain positive..and have..hope..
fish1991222
Established
You protest but you obey the laws, that's how simple it is.
To make a statement you don't need to loot or distroy some innocent shops. People earn those by working really hard for their whole life. There is no justice in burning things down.
I beleive black lives matter, but every people's life matters too.
Make your statement and do it in a correct way. It will not compromise your voice, on the other hand, it shows people who you are, a civilized and educated person fighting for your own right.
Same comments for those so-called pro-demoncracy rioters in HK. Your behaviors are disgusting and do no help to a real policitcal statement.
To make a statement you don't need to loot or distroy some innocent shops. People earn those by working really hard for their whole life. There is no justice in burning things down.
I beleive black lives matter, but every people's life matters too.
Make your statement and do it in a correct way. It will not compromise your voice, on the other hand, it shows people who you are, a civilized and educated person fighting for your own right.
Same comments for those so-called pro-demoncracy rioters in HK. Your behaviors are disgusting and do no help to a real policitcal statement.
keytarjunkie
no longer addicted
This thread ought to be locked or deleted. Beyond the basic facts regarding the destruction of the Leica SoHo store, there is no need for other comments. You people picking fights, or spreading potentially misleading information: go do it on twitter. This is already a small, niche, fragile community. There is no reason to sow hatred on this forum just because you disagree with someone.
It's not the same everywhere. You are not too old to exercise your rights to vote and protest. You are not too old to volunteer for an organization with a platform you support. You can make a change in your local community that will benefit not only you, but the people who come after you. Also, the way you write leads me to believe you are sending some kind of secret message in morse code with all the periods you use.. . . . .. . ...
Consider recent words by Trevor Noah, on why this behavior occurs. These are not new ideas, but they are articulated eloquently:
It's not the same everywhere. You are not too old to exercise your rights to vote and protest. You are not too old to volunteer for an organization with a platform you support. You can make a change in your local community that will benefit not only you, but the people who come after you. Also, the way you write leads me to believe you are sending some kind of secret message in morse code with all the periods you use.. . . . .. . ...
Consider recent words by Trevor Noah, on why this behavior occurs. These are not new ideas, but they are articulated eloquently:
"Society is a contract. It's a contract we sign as human beings amongst each other. We sign a contract with each other as people whether it's spoken or unspoken and we say 'Amongst this group of us, we agree in common rules, common ideals and common practices that are going to define us as a group'. And as with most contracts, the contract is only as strong as the people who are abiding by it. There is no contract if law and people in power don't uphold their end of it."
"Ask yourself why it got you so much more watching these people loot, because they were destroying the contract that you thought they had signed with your society... Imagine if you were them watching that contract being ripped up every single day. Ask yourself how you would feel."
"Ask yourself why it got you so much more watching these people loot, because they were destroying the contract that you thought they had signed with your society... Imagine if you were them watching that contract being ripped up every single day. Ask yourself how you would feel."
It isn't that easy... when peaceful protests do not work, things boil over. I'm not going to pretend I know what it feels like to be someone else... but I can easily think of why people reach the tipping point. It is not fun for everyone involved including the looters, rioters, protesters, store owners, etc. Are there some dummies who only care about getting some consumer goods, sure, but they are the exception IMO.
People who have good lives always think peaceful protesting is the right way (including me). I tend to be able to get what I want through peaceful means. However, I also realize there are those that cannot get what they need through peaceful means. The world is not fair and it never will be. However, some things can be corrected and should be corrected. Racism is just ridiculous.
Archiver
Veteran
As someone who has worked in retail, and has been fortunate enough to be able to go to expensive retail stores, I don't waste sales staff time, and I make sure to display some kind of specialized knowledge or equipment from the get go. The first time I walked into the Melbourne Leica boutique, I had my M9 across my shoulder; the salesperson gave it a glance and were were off to a good start. When I go to a watch boutique, I either ask a question that presupposes specialized knowledge (isn't this the model with the new antimagnetic escapement?) or I pull up my sleeves to wordlessly display what I'm wearing. As a result, I'm generally treated well in just about any expensive shop I visit.
Out to Lunch
Ventor
It's not often one can enjoy narcissism online. Well done!
Hogarth Ferguson
Well-known
Well, I can say that I'm not shocked by the reaction of people in the thread. I shouldn't be surprised that people who covet leica cameras don't have a foot placed in reality.
OK folks, I have opened this thread back up, for DISCUSSION
not attacks. keep your comments civil.
this may be difficult considering all the factors involved, but try.
these are important issues shaping our times and our lives
Stephen
not attacks. keep your comments civil.
this may be difficult considering all the factors involved, but try.
these are important issues shaping our times and our lives
Stephen
james.liam
Well-known