PayPal?

[Jdi]

It's even more complicated, AFAIK, since US American «Debit Cards» and our European «EuroCheque» or «Maestro Cards» are, contrary to common belief, not 100% equivalent.

E.g., in Europe our Bank Cards do not reveal whether one is receiving food stamps, or similar subsidies; whereas in the USA, «Debit Cards» do exactly that, many say. Whether it's true or not, nevertheless probably hence the very negative attitude towards «Debit Cards» that many US Americans have.

I find it amusing when people state "whether it's true or not" yet make ill founded statements never-the-less. My wife and I have homes in the USA and a European country. We have banking relationships in both countries. We have debit cards in both countries. Please educate me to the differences. In 25+ years, we've never noticed any.

Regarding food stamps, those are EBT cards, not debit cards and quite a different animal.

Regarding the "negative attitude". I've never heard of any. 35% of Americans have credit cards, about 20% have debit cards. A rather large amount to not hear "many Americans" have "very negative attitudes" toward them. Not to mention many credit cards work as both credit and debit cards, the merchants ask which way. All of our USA credit cards are like than. Rather convenient as opposed to Europe where we have to have 2 cards.

"Our EuroCheques". EuroCheques were discontinued in 2002. Your post is not that old. Yes, there's a difference, the US still uses good old "checks". No going down to a bank or post office and filling out the little blue form to pay bills. We simply put a check in our mailbox and it goes out the next day.

 

[kxl]

I have been an Ebay buyer & seller and a Paypal user for many years. I've been generally happy with both services, but Ebay policy changes from the past year or two make auctions very buyer-centric. The most common tactic since that policy change has been the "item not as described" scam where a buyer will fraudulently file a dispute with Ebay. If this happens to you as a seller, you are screwed. Ebay will almost always side with the buyer. Of course there are legitimate claims--as a buyer, I have filed a dispute myself (re: a DSLR that was listed as lightly used but EXIF showed over 145K shots) -- and won.

There's really no way to fight against a buyer's fraudulent claim of "item not as described" based on current Ebay policy, but there are ways to somewhat mitigate it.

1) As someone mentioned, you can sell "AS IS" but that potentially scares away a lot of legitimate bidders and has the effect of discounting your item.

2) Include Buyer Requirements in your auctions (what I do), e.g.: exclude bidders:

- With no Paypal Account
- Have received 2 unpaid items within 1 month
- Have 4 policy breaches within 1 month
- Have a feedback with -1 or lower
- Etc...

I also record the serial number of the item I am selling, so if someone requests a refund and ships back a different item, I have some evidence of what I had shipped.
The above options don't eliminate fraud entirely, but it does exclude potential bad actors from bidding. It does have the effect of limiting your market, but it's better than the strategy of selling your item "AS IS."

 

[Jdi]

185 million debit card holders in the United States.
http://www.statista.com/statistics/245402/number-of-debit-card-cardholders-in-the-united-states/

That is almost all adults, they can't all be unhappy. 🙂

I think I'll take your provided link with a grain of salt.

Same site, https://www.statista.com/topics/1598/debit-cards/, it's the source page for your linked page. It shows 5.1 billion as the number of debit cards in the USA and 185 million debit card holders. That's 28 debit cards (and presumably bank accounts) per debit card holder. A lot of plastic to carry around! Not to mention bank accounts to keep track of.

I'm going to assume Statista is using cards issued (which is what typically gets published) and confused it with cards in use. I probably receive 20 prepaid debit cards in the mail each year. Which are all part of issues and all get thrown in the trash. Along with more than half the credit and debit cards I receive from my banks, which I also throw in the trash but are never-the-less tied to my bank accounts. I suspect these statistics are absurdly overstated relative to units actually being used. The 185 million cardholders probably includes a lot of names on mailing lists who threw away the card without opening the envelope. Just sounds high given 20 million have no access at all to banking. Which brings the qualified pool down to around 230 million. I keep hearing about growth potential in debit cards. Doesn't sound like a saturated market. Yet 185 million assumes 80% market penetration. Perhaps time to short bank stocks as this rapidly growing business is about to come to a screeching halt?

Wow, on a photography forum! No more of these posts.

 

[radi(c)al_cam]

Pros? Cons? Do you register with your proper name or a made-up one? People pay into your account, you can pay others out of your account, right? How do you get your money out at the end if there is a surplus? I'm just a babe in the woods with this.

It took me hours to convince the (obviously not so sharp) Ebay guys that I'm the very same person, albeit my bank account's name and the name on my tax papers that they wanted to see, use several variants of my name ... and then: the same procedure with the Paypal guys ———*ANNOYING!

Just this morning, I was lucky, this time I was speaking to very polite and competent female Paypal operators — let's hope they were able to complete the aforementioned «correction» of my allegedly complicated surname ^^

 

[valdas]

Paypay is convenient to buy stuff. I quite hate is if I am the seller - fees are quite high (I pay 3.4%) plus if you want to withdraw (to your card or bank account) you pay additional fees... So if I sell something I keep proceeds in my Paypal account and use for my future purchases. In Europe I prefer very much the direct bank transfer to IBAN account (which is fine with quite many European buyers here on RFF).

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

The problem is that the seller didnt knew how Paypal works. And the money IS ON THE SELLER side. The money is on the seller Paypal account but, because the seller doesnt have many transactions, they usually "freeze" the money for around 15 days in order to protect the buyer. If the buyer files a dispute, the money is on the Paypal side and they able to return it to the buyer. So it is on his account but he cant access to it yet. This is to avoid that you get scammed and the seller can ran off with your money, so to speak.

So, Paypal is actually protecting you 🙂 I, for one, think this is a nice feature.

The reason Paypal brought the freeze in, is because sellers were either registering bogus accounts or hacking legitimate ones, and creating an eBay listing, taking money from buyers but not sending anything, then clearing the funds from the bank account they had linked to the Paypal, and buggering off before any goods, (even if they had been sent, which never happened) could be expected to arrive. By the time the buyer realised their item wasn't coming, the seller had disappeared with the funds, and, the goods not being received, the buyers were (quite legitimately) entitled to seek redress under Paypal's buyer protection scheme. Freezing the funds has nothing to do with protecting the buyer. It is Paypal protecting themselves, by limiting the claims they were paying out to buyers who bought in good faith, and to which they were entitled to claim against, and in respect of which Paypal had little to no realistic hope of ever recouping from the fraudulent sellers. A case of looking out for themselves not for buyers. How surprising. Not!

I listed something on eBay a few weeks ago for the first time in a few years. Even though I've been using eBay/Paypal for years, and have a perfect feedback record both as a buyer and seller, I was still subject to the probationary period before I could access funds from the sale. However I got the best of them anyway. The item never sold; no funds to freeze, LOL.

Paypal is brilliant if you are buying online. If you're selling? Umm, not so much...Larry's tale is more catastrophic than most, but a salient lesson in how badly things can go wrong, if you deal with the wrong type of buyer.
Cheers,
Brett

 

[pepeguitarra]

Lesson learned:

Lesson learned:

1) Buy or sell the amount that you are willing to eventually lose.

2) Dedicate one bank account for Paypal purposes only, with the minimum amount of balance at any time.

I sold a nice lens to an individual for a very low price, i did not use the lens a lot and was tired of seen it. He came back and said the lens was not as described and that it needed to be cleaned and adjusted. Instead of asking him to return it for full refund. I negotiated with him the price of the "clean up" and paid for it. At the end, I sold the lens for $2. Lesson learned: Return the whole thing for full refund.

The opposite can be true too. I bought a Leica M8 from Henry's in Canada. Described as 9/10 almost mint. When I got it, it was dirty, in a box that indicated it was not cared for, sensor dirty. Immediately contacted Henry's and they gave me a return code. I returned and got my money back. Few months later, I wanted to buy something from them and Ebay did not let me bid, it said, the owner has limited my purchased from him. I contacted Henry's and they told me that once you return something in the "abusive" manner I did, they do not want to sell me more. The truth is that I even gave them positive feedback for full refund.

Paypal was initiated by couple of college guys from Berkeley, California. After their success, they were purchased by Ebay.

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Where else am I going to get this stuff?
Steak 'N Shake Promo Cars 3 1958 Chevy Corvette Black, White & Red
http://www.ebay.com/itm/25248576223...99&_trkparms=gh1g=I252485762233.N36.S1.R1.TR2

Why I still love ebay, and have 546 feedback...

I never advised against making online purchases. I'd be hypocritical, if I did. 🙂

 

[sevo]

Many people "rent" a lot of electronics from stores who accept unconditional returns.

I used to work with a stylist who "hired" all her props that way. Occasionally shops did turn sour on her, but usually she talked the managers into a permission to continue that practice, as the shops were interested in getting that exposure...

 

[willie_901]

Two points:

• I've owned a lot of cars since 1969 and not a single one has been stolen or vandalized. Likewise during my entire life none of my residences was ever burglarized. This does not mean my current vehicle won't be stolen tomorrow nor can I can assume I can never be a victim of theft from my home. I have some control over my risk. But then again, maybe I'm just lucky.
• PayPal's risk is it is another vector for digital thieves and irresponsible people (such as a buyer who destroys merchandise and files a PayPal complaint) to take your money and, or cause you a great deal of inconvenience. Some posts in this thread discuses ways to minimize the risks.

 

[Brian Atherton]

PayPal users in the UK should read the following:

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/credit-cards/PayPal-Section75

which I think I've posted before on RFF; still, though a timely reminder of the pitfalls of using PayPal in the UK.

 

[hendriphile]

After writing them a letter, Paypal released the funds to the seller, where they were supposed to have gone in the first place.
An informative post is #47 (thanks, mpaniagua). Now if only someone at PayPal had explained that to us...