What's up at Fuji - PMA 2008

dazedgonebye said:
Now if I could only have back all the money and time I've spent on old folders with bad bellows, overlaping film, and light leaks...I could buy two of these.
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I am sure that's what's driving Fuji's thinking on this product.

/T
 
Thanks for the pics, kuzano :)

kuzano said:
I see an A on the shutter wheel, which looks to operate in Aperture Priority. Wonder if it will operate w/o batteries in manual, and/or if it will meter in manual?
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I wonder what kind of shutter this has. If it's a leaf shutter, it can't be mechanical, because the speed selection is on the top plate; so either it's an electronic leaf shutter (looks smallish, though, not a lot of room for one of those with the large-diameter lens) or it's a focal plane shutter (smallish body for that).

Philipp
 
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This is a joke, no?
A boring "Retro" camera, not even with a wind lever (as far as it seems). So there goes camera evolution. who wants to pay 1500 bucks for a 80 year old design? I hate this retro ideas, pure marketing speculation. I mean seriously, why don't they build a robust 6/7 rangefinder like the Mamyia 7, getting rid of the problems with these (RF alignment) and making it as small as possible. I want to see a tru modern camera, based on the original concepts (RF, bellows if you like). This is clearly a study, but boy, it looks like a gimmick to me.

I want a time machine: the post-digital shock-waves really spoil the minds of the marketing people. they think: oh film users are somehow nostalgic, the "target group" (that's us), is hanging out in forums like RFF and are complaining about "modern" cameras. So lets give them what they want: a camera that looks as if it was build 1920.
I seriously think they are bulliing us.

I truly hope in 5 years people will again concentrate on serious design for cameras.

Shocked, Michael
 
rxmd said:
Hi John,


Just as a side note: This kind of manufacture doesn't work in every market. For example for film it doesn't work, because film is poured; you need relatively large areas to achieve constant emulsion thickness, and you can't pour a 400 ASA emulsion in one place and 1600 ASA emulsion in another.

I have no doubt that there will be a film market in the future, but it will largely belong to companies who have successfully shrunk down their machines so that they can produce smaller volumes. You have to achieve a tradeoff between pouring slowly, improving the chemistry of your emulsion so that you can achieve constant parameters on smaller areas. Agfa had exactly this overcapacity problem; they had one of the most advanced film production plants in Europe, but it was also one of the biggest. The result is what you mention, though; in the end it's the dinosaurs dying out all over again.

Philipp
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Well, Kodak managed to consolidate all their film manufacturing (though not packaging... that's a whole different process) into one facility. They did it with new technology that would have required about 28,000 employees had they not "re-invented" their coating lines. I'm going to see if they give tours on "light days" (as opposed to "dark days" in theatre terms) to get a sense of the new machines, etc.
 
Roger Vadim said:
This is a joke, no?
A boring "Retro" camera, not even with a wind lever (as far as it seems). So there goes camera evolution. who wants to pay 1500 bucks for a 80 year old design? I hate this retro ideas, pure marketing speculation. I mean seriously, why don't they build a robust 6/7 rangefinder like the Mamyia 7, getting rid of the problems with these (RF alignment) and making it as small as possible. I want to see a tru modern camera, based on the original concepts (RF, bellows if you like). This is clearly a study, but boy, it looks like a gimmick to me.

I want a time machine: the post-digital shock-waves really spoil the minds of the marketing people. they think: oh film users are somehow nostalgic, the "target group" (that's us), is hanging out in forums like RFF and are complaining about "modern" cameras. So lets give them what they want: a camera that looks as if it was build 1920.
I seriously think they are bulliing us.

I truly hope in 5 years people will again concentrate on serious design for cameras.

Shocked, Michael
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Don't hold back now. Tell us how you really feel. :rolleyes:
 
Who wants to pay 1500 dollars for a camera like this?

ME.

Jesus, it's awesome to see CHOICES on the new, retail market.

I drive a Kawasaki W650 and a diesel VW Beetle. Everyone else thinks I'm a retard, and I'm OK with that. All of you boring ass, fun-haters can suck it while I ENJOY my life and quirky posessions.
 
rxmd said:
Thanks for the pics, kuzano :)



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I wonder what kind of shutter this has. If it's a leaf shutter, it can't be mechanical, because the speed selection is on the top plate; so either it's an electronic leaf shutter (looks smallish, though, not a lot of room for one of those with the large-diameter lens) or it's a focal plane shutter (smallish body for that).

Philipp
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I think it has to be a leaf shutter. Hey wouldn't it be cool if the shutter is electronic and relays info to and from the body using wireless or bluetooth? :D

What looks odd to me is the bellows, looks very stiff, so maybe plastic?

The speed selector is on the left, I like that.
The lens is rather slow, though, and it doesn't indicate the EBC coating.

Hey this is fun :)
 
luketrash said:
Who wants to pay 1500 dollars for a camera like this?

ME.

Jesus, it's awesome to see CHOICES on the new, retail market.

I drive a Kawasaki W650 and a diesel VW Beetle. Everyone else thinks I'm a retard, and I'm OK with that. All of you boring ass, fun-haters can suck it while I ENJOY my life and quirky posessions.
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Luke, keep cool!

this was a very quick reaction

See: I drive a truly vintage Citroen 2CV, because its a lovely simple car, great design, and the most fun convertible with 27 HP you can imagine. All my cameras are filmbased, except one, rarely seeing the day. I print on bromide paper. I listen to electronic music. Some of it played with vintage gear, some with computers. mostly a mixture. We live in a complex world. Therefore you need complex solutions. This camera (as far as you see on the pics) doesn't look like that.

I just think this camera gives a wrong signal, with it's retro aproach: It's the first new development of a MF film camera and I would just loved to see something like a updated version of the ingenious Plaubel Makina or else to go with my 2CV;); A modern camera which competes with the world of the D3's on a true eye to eye level.

I bet it's fun to use though, a troublefree Agfa Solinar :).

Maybe i've got too many friends in marketing...

Best, Michael
 
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Nothing new in cameras, and no place to go????

Nothing new in cameras, and no place to go????

I'm fine with Retro (or what counts for retro these days). Digital is bound up in technology, yet many want a rangefinder, interchangable lens full sensor digital.
Full sensor cameras require a photo assistant to haul around... (can anyone say Mamiya RB67?)

I drive three cars... 79 BMW 633 coupe, 79 BMW 528i sedan, 85 Saab 900 Turbo.
I shoot a bunch of OLD cameras. Super Speed Graphic, Old Mamiya Folder, A mixed array of other old folders, A Kiev (Kneb) rangefinder, etc.

This camera, in MY grand scheme of things, is darn near perfect. All my old cameras deliver superior images (most medium format) to any digitial i've owned including DSLR. (And I teach digital photography)

Need I say more about my feelings on (YUKKKK!) retro, or no new ideas.

I hope that Fuji brings this camera to market, and that they hit a bullseye in reading the marketplace. May they fortuitously make a ton of money on it, and re-invigorate their product sales.... Yes, even their digital products.
 
Roger Vadim said:
I would just loved to see something like a updated version of the ingenious Plaubel Makina or else to go with my 2CV;); A modern camera which competes with the world of the D3's on a true eye to eye level.

I bet it's fun to use though, a troublefree Agfa Solinar :).

Maybe i've got too many friends in marketing...

Best, Michael
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I'm confused. How is this not an updated Makina?

Lord, I would love to have 2CV ... I think the closest I'll get is if I buy two CV cameras. :p
 
Roger Vadim said:
Luke, keep cool!

this was a very quick reaction

See: I drive a truly vintage Citroen 2CV, because its a lovely simple car, great design, and the most fun convertible with 27 HP you can imagine. All my cameras are filmbased, except one, rarely seeing the day. I print on bromide paper. I listen to electronic music. Some of it played with vintage gear, some with computers. mostly a mixture. We live in a complex world. Therefore you need complex solutions. This camera (as far as you see on the pics) doesn't look like that.

I just think this camera gives a wrong signal, with it's retro aproach: It's the first new development of a MF film camera and I would just loved to see something like a updated version of the ingenious Plaubel Makina or else to go with my 2CV;); A modern camera which competes with the world of the D3's on a true eye to eye level.

I bet it's fun to use though, a troublefree Agfa Solinar :).

Maybe i've got too many friends in marketing...

Best, Michael
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I love it when they bring back the old as new though. And I love the old as old. I've got a few folders (none with rangefinders, unfortunately) and the Agnar lens on my Isolette I works just dandy. I also only paid 8 dollars for that camera, haha.

I should stipulate that I carefully look at these retro products like this camera to see when they have 'done it right' This camera looks awesome to me. Back to motorcycles, when I got my Kawasaki W650 they were also re-releasing Triumph Bonnevilles to the market. The W650 is more true to a vintage heritage than are the Bonnevilles, so that's what I got.

I like some of the stuff Cosina releases, but they seem to miss the mark sometimes in the design department, if you know what I mean. I love old stuff because aesthetically it's much more pleasing to me.

I've seen retro done well and poorly and this Fuji looks to be somewhere inbetween. However, I'd love to have a trouble-free MF Folder that is sharp edge to edge without film plane flatness issues.

As for truly vintage, my garage is full of items my wife hates including two 1970s Vespa scooters, my '66 Austin Healey Sprite, and my '54 Ford sedan.

I'm just a fan of simple mechanical devices that get the job done and look good doing it ;)
 
"As for truly vintage, my garage is full of items my wife hates including two 1970s Vespa scooters, my '66 Austin Healey Sprite, and my '54 Ford sedan."

Dang, Luke, I gotta come to your house sometime!
 
First, thanks for posting these nice pictures, I was dreading having to go all weekend not knowing what this camera would be. I too love it, not only for Fuji putting out another MF camera but also the design. Looks fine to me, and I have to believe they have solved the major issues with a folder/bellows design. I am one who has said, looking at Ebay prices for the Fuji MF cameras, that they ought to get back in the market. I mean, guys, with people paying $1,000 or so for MF cameras with thousands of actuations, there is clearly a market here. Unless it costs too much, I'll definitely buy one. I would have preferred slightly wider lens...say a 60 or 65...but I'm still thrilled. How can so many of you sound so down about this?
 
"Retro?" Certainly. But, isn't this approach targeted at the people who still embrace film the most?

Yeah, i also would like to see a revised Makina 67. But, only because i want a faster lens. The Plaubel's is a 2.8, no? Whatever. This is good news. The RMXL comments are sorta like the silliness on the digital boards, when some schmuck actually professes to be happy that Canon or Nikon DIDN'T release a newer model, so he can feel better about not being able to 'upgrade.' If you don't need it or want it, or don't see the purpose of it, get over it, and tend to things that do interest you. What's the purpose of a campaign against something that clearly isn't meant for you?

That said, could someone please tell me something about folders? Typically, do they offer close-focusing ability? I can't seem to find specs on the classic folders. I'm hoping this new Fuji will go closer than a Mamiya 7, which would make it a better fit for me, with an interest in travel portraiture.....
 
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