RF market post Fuji X100

[Frankie]

Leica aficionados immediately didn't like it because it ain't no interchangeable lens M-Leica...despite many couldn't afford the M8/9, or more than one lens [while a RFF poll indicates 35mm FL being most popular].

RF junkies criticized it because it has no RF patch...AF+AFL notwithstanding.

Zone shooters denounced it because it has no lens barrel markings...despite a virtual focusing scale with DoF indicator available in the O/EVF or LCD. [Zone focusing is really just preset focal distances given an f-stop...the X100 firmware might yet have such a feature.]

Meanwhile, many believe an in-lens shutter precludes later interchangeable lens versions...forgeting Hasselblad was a professional choice for decades with the same "limitation".

Despite Fuji had indicated, and the Leica M8/9 experiences had confirmed a ~20% offset from optimum wouldn't hurt much, especially with better sensor and higher post-processing headroom...many still insist dRF requires new magic.

[I had immediately imagined the 3-stops built-in ND filters could be replaced with 3 anti-vignetting patterns instead...]

I believe the X100 will spawn new-think and renewed defiance of the Thought Police. And that, I believe is what a post Fuji X100 market might evolve into...the product price will guarantee that.

 

[migtex]

I go with Frankie!
It will open an "old" new niche that others will HAVE TO follow. (1000/€/$ Camera is market no "one" can not overlook).

I'm saving already!
And no, I don't indent to get rid of my film RF's!

 

[Wiyum]

[I had immediately imagined the 3-stops built-in ND filters could be replaced with 3 anti-vignetting patterns instead...]

I believe the camera has a single 3-stop filter, essentially an ND 0.9 filter, so were your dream to come to pass, you'd need to pick a single pattern. Though it is likely that the filter is small, and at a point in the optical path where it couldn't feasibly correct vignetting.

 

[Brian Levy]

I think it might be the camera to finally convert me IF it is as good as hoped. Not having a zoom or interchangeable lenses is no big deal for me as I tend to use a 40mm aobut 90% of the time in 35mm format. 35mm I do not care for quite as much but it would be only a little time before I could adjust and happily lve with it. As to the market impact, I'm not sure it will have much effect on the mass produced product nor the 95+% of the population that buys it.

 

[Jamie Pillers]

IF the x100 provides modern aps-c type image quality, and the viewfinder lives up to the hype, and the price isn't ridiculous, then this camera or some version of it WILL be my full-time primary street photography camera. I've been waiting sooooo long for something digital to come along to replace the Hexar AF I sold many years ago. And here it is.. I hope. If this isn't it... "it" is not far away... as I predicted when I joined up here 🙂

As a street photography camera, the x100 could be dynamite! Changing ISO and white balance on the fly while moving in and out of wildly ranging light conditions in Oakland and San Francisco practically requires one to carry multiple cameras loaded with multiple kinds of film. Tired of that.

35mm fixed focal length? Perfect. No 'thinking about some other lens I'd like to have today' stuff. Just go out and make pictures.

I'm just praying that a BIG demand for this camera materializes. Then we might see some competition in this niche. YES!

 

[Jamie Pillers]

x100 the new Barnack?

x100 the new Barnack?

I wonder if anyone said this same thing when the Barnacks first hit the streets all those years ago? 🙄

 

[Nettar]

I've really enjoyed the discussion above, but I wonder whether restricting attention to the Fuji X100 is narrowing perspective too much. Let's look beyond that camera to those that will follow, enlightened by Iker Morán's insightful interview (for Quesabesde) with Hiroshi Kawahara, the Operations Manager at Fujifilm's Electronic Imaging Products Division. That interview is headlined "The FinePix X100 is the starting point of the high-end cameras to follow in future," and the longer quotation from Mr Kawahara is:

"I'm happy to hear people commenting that Fujifilm came back to the professional market. The FinePix X100 is the starting point of the high-end cameras to follow in future, and although I can not tell you anything specific at this stage, please look forward to new Fujifilm cameras in the future."

See http://www.quesabesde.com/noticias/fujifilm-finepix-x100-entrevista-hiroshi-kawahara,1_en_7074

I wonder whether I am alone in thinking that the innovative viewfinder of the X100 is rather eccentric for a camera with a fixed 23mm lens -- in particular, for a camera that actually could cope quite well with just the electronic viewfinder. Wouldn't a hybrid viewfinder, with rangefinder facilities, be ideal for a very compact digital camera with interchangeable lenses, particularly wide angle lenses? A rangefinder would be ideal for getting accurate focus with lenses such as an 18mm f/4 (an electronic viewfinder is not so helpful here), and the electronic viewfinder would be great for framing accurately, assessing depth of field, and so forth, for a wider variety of lenses. Perhaps an interchangeable lens camera with a hybrid viewfinder, and rangefinder-like characteristics, is one of the "new Fujifilm cameras in the future."

 

[skibeerr]

Your original answer is a little over dramatic me thinks. But you are right if I alone where the entire market.

Being a Hexar af lover when the x1 was released I gave it a few hours of thought,
but it was the lack of VF that killed it for me.
The price of the x1 is correct if compared with the other Leica offerings, lack of competition in a niche market.

The x100 blew me off my socks just with some photo's and a list of specs, crazy isn't it
and I am not alone!
Hopefully Fuji has chosen a decent production run/ price, and discarded the niche market approach.

So again the answer is yes if I where the world market.

Wim

 

[skibeerr]

I wonder if anyone said this same thing when the Barnacks first hit the streets all those years ago? 🙄

OH but they DID change the camera scene back then!!!

 

[jarski]

just imagine the fuss in camera forums when Canon or Nikon announce first specs about their future Mirrorless camera system 😛

 

[jsrockit]

I agree that form factor is the same. I have a G2, so I understand that argument. I would suggest that those few that do use rangefinders will also continue to use rangefinders because the X100 is not a rangefinder. I have been waiting for a compact digital and unlike you, did not spring for the X1. If the X100 is not what I am expecting I will wait for the X2, Nikon, Canon, or maybe consider the GXR. That said, I own at least ten true rangefinder cameras and I will continue to use them. There really isn't much of a market for new rangefinders and perhaps that is the point of the post. Will manufacturers simply stop making rangefinders with the introduction of the X100? I'm amazed that they still make these cameras, so why not market very high price rangefinders after the X100? That said, I question the future of mechanical rangefinders. Certainly, electronics will and can replace such a mechanism, which is prone to misalignment and is relatively delicate.

Yes, the M10 will be a rangefinder.

I see what you mean. I will buy the X100 as well (even while owning the GXR and X1). I don't mind having multiple cameras (like you, but all digital)... at least one will be inspirational on any given day. I think film rangefinders will exist for many years in some form... we have 3 different brands making 35mm RF cameras right now...more than the 1990s had prior to digital. We've seen more RF cameras introduced in 2000-2010 than we've seen in quite awhile. I just don't think we will see anyone but Leica make a true manual focus rangefinder in digital. Many people who are film only seem to make fun of the X100 as a camera that is trying to look retro but isn't really retro. I have no issue with that, but I've fully embraced digital these days.

 

[thegman]

Can't see it making much difference, I doubt it will affect the range finder market, as it's not a range finder. It looks cool of course, so maybe those people who get range finders for the looks/size might be tempted though.

 

[migtex]

More X100 GAS!!

 

[ampguy]

sure

sure

I think that once folks realize it's made by CV and the OVF can get mis-aligned easily, and the lens has distortion, and you can't replace the lens without replacing the camera, that Sony NEX sales will take off like crazy!

It will help put a nail in the coffin the u4/3 though.

Any other questions? 😉

Anyone willing to speculate what the RF market, film and digital, would be like after X100 is released? Do you fear a weakening of demand for RF cameras and a reduction in used market value for both film and digital RFs? This is in case Fuji X100 lives to its promise. I'd appreciate rational and pragmatic answers, thanks.

 

[jsrockit]

I think that once folks realize it's made by CV and the OVF can get mis-aligned easily, and the lens has distortion, and you can't replace the lens without replacing the camera...

Yeah, I mean... because CV makes so much garbage.

 

[shadowfox]

I think that once folks realize it's made by CV and the OVF can get mis-aligned easily, and the lens has distortion, and you can't replace the lens without replacing the camera, that Sony NEX sales will take off like crazy!

It will help put a nail in the coffin the u4/3 though.

Any other questions? 😉

Keep pedaling, Ted. 😛

 

[Benjamin Marks]

I have no interest in acquiring one of these, but I have to say there are a lot of innovations wrapped up in the camera and I think the amount of buzz it is getting cannot have escaped Fuji's notice, or that of the other photo mfct'rers. I dearly want to see innovation in this market segment rewarded, particularly as in the world of digi-cams there is a me-too'ism which I find boring and that leads to lackluster products. I would love to see Nikon and Canon take notice of the market segment (to quote Bill Murray's character in "Caddyshack" "How 'bout a little something for the effort?"). I have a hard time seeing how the success or failure of a fixed lens camera will "kill the micro 4/3 segment," as one poster would have it. Maybe I have missed the irony somewhere . . .

[edit: from the Fuji exec's interview above: "Furthermore, it is very difficult for an interchangeable lenses system to be compatible with a "hybrid viewfinder" system. In addition, achieving compact size and structure for high-resolution becomes a problem in interchangeable lenses systems. We will of course consider the possibility of forthcoming models reflecting the expectation of the end-users. " -- Doesn't sound like anyone is getting any nails in their coffin anytime soon . . .]

Ben Marks

 

[tapesonthefloor]

Agreed! Gunga galunga, camera industry. Gunga. Galunga.

 

[Wiyum]

I think that once folks realize it's made by CV and the OVF can get mis-aligned easily, and the lens has distortion, and you can't replace the lens without replacing the camera, that Sony NEX sales will take off like crazy!

It will help put a nail in the coffin the u4/3 though.

Any other questions? 😉

Jeez, that hadn't occurred to me! You wouldn't have recently acquired an NEX camera and want confirmation for your purchase, would you?

Seriously, you come off as a defensive brand troll...

If this camera performs as promised, it will be a new segment, and an amazing product.

Meanwhile, as one who has held and used an NEX, I can say that this camera, thankfully, has nothing in common with the NEX, as far as I understand. I like manual controls, real viewfinders, and camera design that assumes that I'm not an idiot or a new-camera owner.

I and Sony alone must be glad that you enjoy the assumption that you know nothing of cameras or photography when using Sony's latest NEX camera...

 

[GSNfan]

Since this new round of X100 news, there have been two M8s going for $1800 in the classified section of this forum. Just a coincidence or the start of a trend? We'll have to wait and see.

I might have fallen off the X100 bandwagon but I'm afraid even if this camera is not everything its touted to be, still a lot of people will buy it just for the way it looks, not that there is anything wrong with that.