Brutally honest critique thread

Was not even thinking if they were "good" or "positive," irrelevant to my point. I don't personally like the approach especially among amateurs. You were of course invited.

I think the idea of the thread is to practice giving and receiving "critique" rather than simply back patting or remaining silent.
An exercise from both sides.

It's not an academic setting or even one where all involved are qualified. That's not the point (my view anyway).
The point is more to try and be constructive.

With online boards everyone is an amateur.
Some pros may be cooler headed if they remembered that! 🙂
 
I think the idea of the thread is to practice giving and receiving "critique" rather than simply back patting or remaining silent.
An exercise from both sides.

It's not an academic setting or even one where all involved are qualified. That's not the point (my view anyway).
The point is more to try and be constructive.

With online boards everyone is an amateur.
Some pros may be cooler headed if they remembered that! 🙂

Yes, thank you!
 
U39974I1416326212.SEQ.0.jpg
 
Was not even thinking if they were "good" or "positive," irrelevant to my point. I don't personally like the approach especially among amateurs.

You were of course invited.

... I could point out the same failings in your attitude. Do you think 'especially among amateurs' is anything but condescending? ... many of us Ned included don't post anonymously, don't have your facility to alter our posts and do put our work up for comment, and you do what exactly?
 
How can one possibly know if they are being constructive?

There is no guarantee of benifit... it's true.
However, I think it's a chance to interact that many value and may not otherwise have access to.
Examining and analyzing in search of improvements is a good exercise imo and, one to encourage and foster in a social construct such as this one (rff).
 
There seems to be a disconnect here as to what people are expecting and what people are offering.
For example, I simply want to hear your emotional reaction (and why) to the pictures I am posting. I already know what they are technically ("the highlights are burned", "it's blurry", "the sky is purple" . . . I KNOW that - I made the picture!). what I want to know is .... what is your emotional reaction when you look at it.
That however does not seem to be what "critics" want to offer, or what most posters are asking for.

(The comments made about my Pieta photo were excellent input. The sentences above are meant generically.)
 
Children need to be handled much differently than adults, that's for sure. Pretty much the opposite way. A child learns best when positives are emphasized. For a (mature) adult, pointing to the deficiencies is most efficient, IMO.

Granted, there are adults who are too fragile to hear and accept this, and they have been warned in post #1 not to participate. This is the big boys' critique thread.
 
@ Helen: I especially appreciated the mood of this image: the contrast between the glitter of 'NY' and the huddled isolation of the couple. The light and shadow are just right for the content/context – very Robert Frankish.

But I agree with earlier comment that you might crop it more carefully (unless cropping is against your religion). At first I thought the lights right at the top were necessary to keep the illumination at the center of the image from looking artificial. But on looking more carefully, I think the lower light by itself creates enough 'illusion of reality.' So 'turn off' the top lights?

Because of the black background of the website, I can't tell quite where the left and right boundaries of the picture fall. To my eye there's too much emptiness at the left. The mood of the image suggests the left should fade into blackness, and the empty stool is part of the mood of the picture; but I would still suggest cropping some off this side. IMO there's no call for straightening the verticals.

I'm glad we're looking at some pictures again and not just squabbling about critiquing. IMO the difficulty has been the word 'brutal,' which probably just confuses things. A critique should be extensive and constructive, with constructive meaning telling folks honestly both (a) where their strengths lie and (b) what they need to work harder on. But if brutal suggests uncivil, it's the wrong word.

@Dave: Thank god somebody has a sense of humor here: the Pieta was just the right spirit at that point. And the Masterpiece With Mamiya seems to be generating a critique among its subjects, even before any comments appear here.

I tried earlier to post a shot that was sort of a joke about photography, but mine fell flat (as it no doubt deserved). Thanks for yours,

Kirk
 
I truly think we need the option of this kind of thread. It is most certainly not for everyone. And of course by brutal, I'm not suggesting physical violence.

:angel:
 
A nice moment - did you know what she was up to, or just spot her?

I'd be tempted to crop out the top dummy (though it leaves all sorts of awkward debris along the top) to bring it in a bit closer, though I could be being picky here because it doesn't all fit on my laptop screen and I have to scroll up and down to see it all. I don't think a bit off the bottom would hurt either, but that's just tidying up the floor in front of the near dummy's feet.

Adrian

Thank you for the response. I have never participated in anything like this before, so I thought I'd slip one in while there was a bit of a distraction. ;-)

The moment was a bit of both. She was behind me and walked up to the mannequins and blended right in. I turned around and there was that pause that every parent has when you realize that someone is not accounted for -I waited for her to remove the smirk and that was that. She (and I) liked it, so we did a few more posed examples as we walked on in the store.

I agree about the crop on top and bottom by quickly panning the zoomed image (thread) up, down, and around on my iPad. I will try an official crop when I have more time. Thanks!
 
Children need to be handled much differently than adults, that's for sure. Pretty much the opposite way. A child learns best when positives are emphasized. For a (mature) adult, pointing to the deficiencies is most efficient, IMO.

Granted, there are adults who are too fragile to hear and accept this, and they have been warned in post #1 not to participate. This is the big boys' critique thread.

What does that mean??
To me, what you are saying is simplistic to being pointless.

"Deficiencies" ??? What are you talking about?

Here is an example of a viewer / photographer disconnect.....

Hsg made an excellent observation that my Pieta photo had no details in the shadows. Of course Hsg is perfectly correct and I of course agree - I was the guy who blackened the shadows. Hsg perceived that to be a "deficiency" because (as explained) black shadows (in his emotional view) make the image appear flat. That was a mind-opening revelation to me because to my emotional view black shadows add more dimension to images.

Telling me "there's no details in the shadows" was useless ( I KNEW that !!). Telling me his emotional reaction (it makes the image look flat) was extremely good input to me.

So.... I know the highlights are blown, the image is soft, the sky is purple. Those are not deficiencies (to me). If I perceived them to be defieciencies, I would not have shown you the picture. What I need you to do as a critic is to tell me how you react emotionally to what I just showed you.
 
There is nothing wrong with having such threads.
1. Post your image.
2. Leave this thread alone for a day.
3. Return calmly to the thread. Take a deep breath. Practice self control. Yoga may help if you can do such stuff (I don't).
4. Do NOT think bad thoughts about FrankS. He did not create your image that is being attacked from the left (Democratic reviewers) and from the right (Autocratic reviewers).
5. Stay calm, Do not panic. [Ooops. This is what I put on the cover sheets of my exams).
6. Say 100 times over and over "I am not that bad in photography" until you believe it too.
7. To complete the loop, post another of your images here.
 
Still wanting to keep us on Pictures, more than Criticism of Criticism. Here are two that I shot last weekend. I took them about an hour apart while trying out an elderly LTM lens.

Because these don't look like the pictures I usually make, I wonder what (if anything) folks might have to say about them.

16581976506_6f41dbd5f2_c.jpg
[/url]A sign that says CAFE by thompsonkirk, on Flickr[/IMG]

16065830424_e8742c9f4f_c.jpg
[/url]ClaudeAlley by thompsonkirk, on Flickr[/IMG]
PS, I'll follow Raid's good advice!
 
.......


So you want to know if others feel, what you feel? They see your reasoning? In the overall picture?

Really do they like it, or not, in a nutshell?

Pretty much that is correct. What is "your" reaction (positive or negative) to this picture and (if possible) can you tell me why. Don't tell me "the sky looks purple" and drop it there.

Thank you, I think we just connected. I think.
 
OK, in response to Andy's post^^^, I'll go around again. I'm working on a project on suburbs, including suburban environments and vernacular architecture there, with Sunnyvale, CA, as my principal subject. Sort of the antithesis of urban environments with their rich targets for street photographers. Here's a recent photo. What do you think?

Morning walk by bingley0522, on Flickr


I like suburban, and this one, a touch closer to remove the kerb in the left corner.
Do you have fav photographers who do suburban?
 
What does that mean??
To me, what you are saying is simplistic to being pointless.

"Deficiencies" ??? What are you talking about?

Here is an example of a viewer / photographer disconnect.....

Hsg made an excellent observation that my Pieta photo had no details in the shadows. Of course Hsg is perfectly correct and I of course agree - I was the guy who blackened the shadows. Hsg perceived that to be a "deficiency" because (as explained) black shadows (in his emotional view) make the image appear flat. That was a mind-opening revelation to me because to my emotional view black shadows add more dimension to images.

Telling me "there's no details in the shadows" was useless ( I KNEW that !!). Telling me his emotional reaction (it makes the image look flat) was extremely good input to me.

So.... I know the highlights are blown, the image is soft, the sky is purple. Those are not deficiencies (to me). If I perceived them to be defieciencies, I would not have shown you the picture. What I need you to do as a critic is to tell me how you react emotionally to what I just showed you.

Not sure why you are/seem so angry! 🙂

If thats what you want, if thats what critique means to you, then just ask for that. no one can read your mind to know what you do and do not want in a critique. i believe that commenting on technical aspects is part of a critique. obviously you have a different personal definition.
Maybe you should realize that they are deficiencies. Why are you asking for critique if you know what the problems are?
 
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